Federal student loan repayments to restart

The revolution has already started. It begins on college campuses.

When I was in my thirties with
applying for a mortgage for my current house I was overwhelmed with how much paperwork, proof of every aspect of my life and how specific the amount I could borrow was.

When I was 18 with a crappy part time job filling out a few pages online I could get a student loan for an obscene amount of money.

It took nearly a decade but mine were repaid.

Nothing will ever convince me student loans are not predatory. Especially for students like me whose parents were not fiscally savvy.

All public student loan debt should be abolished!

All public institutions should also be tuition-free as well. You would still have to pay for books, housing, supplies, etc.

It's not really worth the cost of college anymore with the job prospects afterwards. This level of college debt is not sustainable to maintain without justification in average salary post-college to prove it makes sense.

Better to go to trade school at this point. I would only advise a kid get an affordable four year degree to have it on paper, and not worry about any expensive schools. Grad school is a waste of time.

libertysnake said:

It's not really worth the cost of college anymore with the job prospects afterwards. This level of college debt is not sustainable to maintain without justification in average salary post-college to prove it makes sense.

Better to go to trade school at this point. I would only advise a kid get an affordable four year degree to have it on paper, and not worry about any expensive schools. Grad school is a waste of time.

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If someone can get a good degree that has solid job potential at an affordable price I would encourage them to do so. The current need for workers in the trades will not last forever. I can easily see things shifting the other way.

Depick said:

If someone can get a good degree that has solid job potential at an affordable price I would encourage them to do so. The current need for workers in the trades will not last forever. I can easily see things shifting the other way.

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Degrees don't really mean shit anymore. We don't really hire people, at least in my industry, based on "what" degree someone has. A computer science degree is "nice" to have, but generally is fairly obsolete by the time you're fingers on keyboard writing code in a real work environment. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to understand the basic data structures and sorting algorithms out there. (@SonOfSun / @SomeSoldier feel free to disagree.)

Academics can teach, but largely can't do the actual job (I've found) when the rubber hits the road. A coworker who has actually done the job is a far better resource than some overly expensive college textbook. The real world isn't neat and perfect. It's filled with politics, gatekeeping, holy code, and security engineers who execute kali linux scripts for a living.

90% of the time we want to just see they have "some" degree, and then it's all talking to the person about real world experience learned on the job. So if the degree doesn't matter, just get whatever you like and learn the skills from a coding bootcamp / just start writing your own libraries and contributing to projects.

Saltwater60 said:

Not true anymore. All you can get without co-signer from .gov is $5,500 then by your senior year it goes up to about $7,500-$8,000. I’m going through all this with my kids right now. I opted to pay half his tuition instead of co-signing for loans for him. I refuse to do so at 10% interest through private party lending. When you go to graduate school you can take more in loans but for undergraduate degree you can’t even cover UB tuition and fees. He’ll it doesn’t cover a community college either these days. Also my son needs an extra semester to finish because of scheduling and a bad first semester soon loans for that. It’s not a blank check as many think for undergraduate studies. The crazy loan amounts are for grad school or with private loans.

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Definitely different than when I went to school. ECC was about $3000 a year and Buff State was about $5000 a year.

libertysnake said:

Degrees don't really mean shit anymore. We don't really hire people, at least in my industry, based on "what" degree someone has. A computer science degree is "nice" to have, but generally is fairly obsolete by the time you're fingers on keyboard writing code in a real work environment. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to understand the basic data structures and sorting algorithms out there. (@SonOfSun / @SomeSoldier feel free to disagree.)

Academics can teach, but largely can't do the actual job (I've found) when the rubber hits the road. A coworker who has actually done the job is a far better resource than some overly expensive college textbook. The real world isn't neat and perfect. It's filled with politics, gatekeeping, holy code, and security engineers who execute kali linux scripts for a living.

90% of the time we want to just see they have "some" degree, and then it's all talking to the person about real world experience learned on the job. So if the degree doesn't matter, just get whatever you like and learn the skills from a coding bootcamp / just start writing your own libraries and contributing to projects.

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I definitely agree that many industries don’t care about degrees anymore. There definitely are some professions that require a degree. Lawyers, engineers, doctors etcetera. I can say for my industry, engineers, architects, project managers and the like are always more effective and well respected when they have some field experience and not straight out of school.

Of course the left wing media will act as if they were never to be paid back. Key word here is "restart".

Highly disagree with the notion that college degrees are a waste, but there are plenty of people who waste their time in college, and/or choose degrees with very limited employment potential. A STEM degree will give a person a big leg up. While I will agree that a person who knows what they are doing (ex: coding) can get by without a degree, they will have a much harder time getting their foot in the door and will constantly be playing catch-up, salary-wise, when they do.

A colleague of mine has no degree, but he can code circles around me (and pretty much anyone else) all day long. He started with this company a few years before me, but I'm two levels above him and have had a bigger paycheck since forever. I also came right in as an employee, while he had to backdoor his way in as a contractor who eventually became an employee. He would have a much harder time finding employment at another company than I would, and would likely need to take a backdoor route again if he were to.

This difference all comes down to degrees.

I came out of college maybe $30k in debt (went the CC/SUNY route for my undergrad work), but I more than made up for that, salary-wise, in just the first year or two, compared to my colleague. Had my employer pay for my graduate degree from Cornell, making me even more marketable. My colleague doesn't have that option as they don't pay for undergrad degrees.

Is all of this fair? No. Does it make sense? Not entirely, though a degree does establish an implied baseline of know-how, which makes hiring that person less risky. But, this is the way things are done. You have to play the game by the rules that are set. I had a mentor once tell me that the college degree was less about the education than it was showing that the potential employee could put the work in to succeed at significant challenges.

Plus, college was an absolute riot. I had absolutely no idea it would be that much fun, and I undoubtedly learned a ton while having the time of my life. I look back on those years with great fondness and confidence that I made a good investment.

That said, college is not for everyone, and this is where I think we falter. Guidance counselors seem to want to push everyone to college, when the reality is that it will just be a waste of time and money for many. People need to approach college with the understanding that the purpose of being there is to improve your employment prospects. Going beyond the traditional "art degree is a waste" example: I think going to college to be a teacher is a waste (though less so)... something that should only be done by people who have an actual desire to teach. It's not a lucrative field, though it does tend to offer employment stability.

Also, trades are not a bad thing in the least. I know lots of guys in various construction-related jobs that make money hand over fist. Plumbers and HVAC professionals can do quite well, for example, and are always in high demand.

the only thing a degree proves is that you can show up to class for 4 to 8 years ..

Saltwater60 said:

Community college is about $7,000-$7,500 per year now. When I went it was the same price as you. UB for general undergrad is about $13,000. This is after books and fees. Fees for UB are almost $4,000 now. Dorming at UB is around $17,500. My kid doesn’t dorm because I’m not paying for that.

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WOW that is nuts.

My wife is Admin at the local community college, so my daughter only pays for books and labs. And in her chosen field, after her AA she can transfer to UCC and they'll PAY her tuition if she commits to the local hospital for a certain number of years after getting her Bachelors. Plus she's working a full time job in patient care that coincides perfectly with her schedule and is 22yrs old making about $40K already.

Work SMART.

We, the people should take this one step further....

Anyone that had their loans "forgiven (paid for by the American people), should have that debt put back on them.

This should have never happened to any loan.

Dump the debt back to the place in which it belongs.

tgenec86 said:

My wife is Admin at the local community college, so my daughter only pays for books and labs. And in her chosen field, after her AA she can transfer to UCC and they'll PAY her tuition if she commits to the local hospital for a certain number of years after getting her Bachelors. Plus she's working a full time job in patient care that coincides perfectly with her schedule and is 22yrs old making about $40K already.

Work SMART.

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hat's great for you and your daughter (really), but lots of people don't want to go to collage. Where I work we have a couple young guys and an older guy approaching retirement age that pump fuel and wash trucks, starting wage? That position starts out at $24 per hr with a $2 and $4 shift differential. Yeah there's no real future in that but it's a good start and most of them use that as stepping stone to move into the truck shop as a tech and make more. I hope your daughter does good , my wife got burned out after 20 years.

tgenec86 said:

My wife is Admin at the local community college, so my daughter only pays for books and labs. And in her chosen field, after her AA she can transfer to UCC and they'll PAY her tuition if she commits to the local hospital for a certain number of years after getting her Bachelors. Plus she's working a full time job in patient care that coincides perfectly with her schedule and is 22yrs old making about $40K already.

Work SMART.

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Love this. I was able to do 2 degrees for free as well.

Had some student loans back in the day, joined the Army and they paid those off. As time went on, I was able to degree for free.

tgenec86 said:

My wife is Admin at the local community college, so my daughter only pays for books and labs. And in her chosen field, after her AA she can transfer to UCC and they'll PAY her tuition if she commits to the local hospital for a certain number of years after getting her Bachelors. Plus she's working a full time job in patient care that coincides perfectly with her schedule and is 22yrs old making about $40K already.

Work SMART.

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My cousin is an occupational therapist. She took a teaching position at a private college. Took a small pay cut but all three of her kids went there for next to nothing. Not a bad deal.

Well not all degrees are shit. I have a Masters in Engineering. I make over 200k a year. A degree is a requirement my career, even if someone is bright and their mind works naturally as an engineer, if they don't have that piece of paper they won't get hired. I don't agree with it, but it is what it is.

I had some student loan debt and paid it off within 10yrs. I rented and drove new, but cheap, vehicles. I do not agree that student loans should be forgiven. It is a debt they signed up for and should pay back.

My kids are getting older and the topic of what they want to do with their lives comes up often. I prefer they find interest in a trade honestly. My daughter may be the only one that will go to college. She loves animals and was thinking vet related or marine biology. I told her we would help her, but she has to be 100% certain that is what she wants to do. My boys will most likely be blue collar. Oldest likes electronics and electricity. I have taught him to wire a house. The youngest likes construction stuff. Course hes only 4, but he can drive a tractor lol.

Hochulsucks1234 said:

Well not all degrees are shit. I have a Masters in Engineering. I make over 200k a year. A degree is a requirement my career, even if someone is bright and their mind works naturally as an engineer, if they don't have that piece of paper they won't get hired. I don't agree with it, but it is what it is.

I had some student loan debt and paid it off within 10yrs. I rented and drove new, but cheap, vehicles. I do not agree that student loans should be forgiven. It is a debt they signed up for and should pay back.

My kids are getting older and the topic of what they want to do with their lives comes up often. I prefer they find interest in a trade honestly. My daughter may be the only one that will go to college. She loves animals and was thinking vet related or marine biology. I told her we would help her, but she has to be 100% certain that is what she wants to do. My boys will most likely be blue collar. Oldest likes electronics and electricity. I have taught him to wire a house. The youngest likes construction stuff. Course hes only 4, but he can drive a tractor lol.

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Get your oldest into control wiring, PLCs and industrial maintenance. It’s a very well paying and in demand sector for electricians. Easier on the body as well. I know not a concern for a young guy but blue collar work catches up with you.

Depick said:

Get your oldest into control wiring, PLCs and industrial maintenance. It’s a very well paying and in demand sector for electricians. Easier on the body as well. I know not a concern for a young guy but blue collar work catches up with you.

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I agree. I have worked a lot with PLCs and SCADA devices from the programmatic side. My experience with the guys that field them has always been positive. He has mentioned becoming a lineman. We see a lot of the guys working on the upgraded transmission lines from Massena to Marcy. He is intrigued by the things those guys do. He is also fearless, so that helps.

pshift said:

All public student loan debt should be abolished!

All public institutions should also be tuition-free as well. You would still have to pay for books, housing, supplies, etc.

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Absolutely not. That would be an absolute disaster.

If you think college costs a lot now, wait till it's "free".

What should happen is colleges themselves should be on the hook for any default on a student loan. Not the taxpayers, but the institution that charged some dumb kid $200k for a basket weaving degree.

Saltwater60 said:

There needs to be controls put in both sides of the coin. No loans for pointless degrees but in the flip side of someone can’t help you financially there is no way you can afford college these days.
Myron goes to UB and his schedule is all over the place he can not work during the semester outside of Saturday and Sunday but he has struggled to find anyone will to hire him for less than 4 days per week. Another kids I know are complaining about the same.

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I’d like to see some mandatory financial education in high schools or a mandatory class before a student loan can be obtained.

Anything that will show the borrower the long term effect and repercussions of those loans.

Maybe even a capped fixed interest rate.

Im assuming Myron is your son? I would say that is the hard part of being a student. I used to schedule as many classes as I could on either a MWF or TTH schedule. I would be at school sun up to sun down and work the other days. I used to sign up for online courses as well. I had an entire semester of all online classes once. It sucked but somehow I managed to get through. I’m sure he’ll figure something out.

When baby boomers went to college...1964 on...............most tuition was cheap.

A college education for teachers, engineers, medicine, is still necessary.....a Liberal Arts degree was worthless, for baby boomers, except for professional level Government Service, as a basic requirement to keep out BLM, and HS riffraff, from the military officer corps and Fed LE positions.

THINGS CHANGED.............THE COST OF THESE SLUGS.

Since 1990, the number of minorities who got WORTHLESS fake degrees proliferated-------- like law school push thrus, ...YOU KNOW WHO, and social work degrees, proliferated...many in the Fed Govt doing nothing, working at home

NYS began farming out many"professional" jobs to get rid of these slugs.................NYS leads the way in not hiring million of human slime, fat dumb childless cat ladies, and LBGTQ+i.

The un-payable student debt will be cancelled......... at death. All colleges should have to eagt one half of the unpayable debt, for letting bozo in.