spat
.950 JDJ
Irrelevant if you can’t win.
Any Support for the Independant Candidate Jo Jorgensen?
- Thread starter mgunner
- Start date
You are kidding right?
Did you look around?
Your knowledge of the Libertarian party is wrong....period.
Libertarianism goes from far left to far right. This is well known by most people.
This is day one stuff here.
Left-libertarianism - Wikipedia
I dont even use autocorrect....its all me.@Criticalt well that argument should shut you up! Your autocorrect failed like @drowhawk ’s argument.
But its true....if you misspell a word your argument is null and void.
I blame Cornell University for my mispelling.
spat
.950 JDJ
Well, in fairness libertarianism in principle has elements of both the left and the right.You are kidding right?
Did you look around?
Your knowledge of the Libertarian party is wrong....period.
Libertarianism goes from far left to far right. This is well known by most people.
This is day one stuff here.
Left-libertarianism - Wikipedia
en.m.wikipedia.org
The fact that libertarianism is now seen as "right wing" is just evidence of how far the whole country has slipped to the left.
On an absolute sense libertarianism would be a good definition for the center.
My point is that so many people believe libertarianism to be far right or at least right of conservatism.
In fact they cover the spectrum of political beliefs.
People interpret "personal autonomy".....or self governing differently.
Some follow the constitution.....right leaning.
But some follow their own wishes and beliefs....being able to live in saftey without guns, closing the borders, banning the murder of babies in the womb.
But they all call themselves "libertarians".
They all generally agree with small to no government, strict property laws and complete freedom from government rule.
Its their personal beliefs of freedom and autonomy that separates them.
It amazes me that so called libertarians dont even understand their political party.....how can we?
Jcp123
.357 mag
From their perspective, certainly not.
I forget if it’s Radiolab or Freakonomics (I believe it’s the latter) which had an interesting episode. They essentially saw the parties as monopolizing the market of politics from an applied economics point of view. I liked their analysis, though they lost me a little bit at the end with some of their prescriptions.
If Cumho and Diblasio stick to their anti-Orthodox Jew crusade, NY can definitely be in play. Those guys a) vote as told, b) are expert level scammers, c) don't like to lose.
I'm making a few assumptions here, so if I'm wrong please correct me.
Assumption 1- Orthodox vote democrat
Assumption 2- (based on post) they are told to vote Democrat
This is where I'm a bit lost. Where is the messaging telling them to not vote Democrat? Honest question
Catskillkid
.450/400 Nitro Ex
It basically comes down to the rabbi. In ultra orthodox hasidism the religious authorities are revered and call the shots even when it comes to voting. On State level politics they have tended to vote Democrat. The Dems cater to them because they get a good block vote out of it
Saltwater60
20×102mm Vulcan
So your stance on immigration truly is open boarders? I just can’t see how anyone could support that. We have to know and control who’s in our country. If not all is lost.
Saltwater60
20×102mm Vulcan
My shit bag union supports the democrats too and they fuck them and is workers every chance they get. My union asked if I wanted some asshole democrats sign and I never responded. Guess what showed up one day stuck in my lawn on the city property in front of my house. I was backing out to go some where and noticed it sitting there. I stopped traffic to toss it in my trunk. It will get bullet holes tomorrow.
Two days ago there was a massive orthodox rally in Brooklyn where Trump flags were the centerpiece.
You're right: they're known for voting lockstep democrat. But that's because NY democrats have always bent over backwards for them. If there's any group willing to prove to democrats "don't fuck with us," it's them.
If Cumho and Diblasio keep it up, don't be surprised if they're told to prove a point.
TEOTWAWKI inc.
.338 Win Mag
Haha. The far or radical center, but yes, I agree.
Jcp123
.357 mag
No, I wouldn’t say that. I think it’s a goal to aspire to, but the human condition right now won’t allow that. Open borders is either 100 generations away, or will need some aliens to land before it’s any kind of a workable or practical thought. I’m absolutely for border controls and a good steady method for who can be here and who can’t.
My frustration is exemplified by what you said: that I’m for open borders. Being more lax on immigration doesn’t instantly translate to open borders. There aren’t just two poles on this or any subject, there’s a lot of nuance in between.
It's sad, but this forum is very slow to come to grips with reality.
They are just barely now getting on the "maybe the NRA isn't that great" bandwagon.
masterswimmer
.450/400 Nitro Ex
There's already laws, procedures, guidelines and the freedom to do it the legal way in place right now. JUST. OBEY. THE. LAW. Nobody is saying we should lock down the borders and prohibit anyone from immigrating to the USA.
Jcp123
.357 mag
Yup, and I don’t have a problem with that. Where I do have a problem is in the assumption that immigrants are troublemakers. I’m not sure how to explain where I am, but I am perfectly OK with border controls, just not if they are enforced with the basic mindset that immigrants = bad.
masterswimmer
.450/400 Nitro Ex
I don't think most people are saying immigrants are bad. Obviously some will say that. However, those that don't follow the letter of the law to enter legally are already executing a criminal act. So not doing it the right way puts them in the category of criminal right off the bat.
Again.....JUST. FOLLOW. THE. LAW.
Jcp123
.357 mag
Well here’s the thing that the right here doesn’t grasp: they have sounded xenophobic for a long time, arguing about how our culture will change, or most pointedly how our President campaigned on what kind of dregs we’re importing. If that’s not what Republicans mean to say, then they need to sort out that messaging. I don’t think it’s a policy problem, or if it is, it’s not the main thing.
Jcp123
.357 mag
Hey I mean, since I get negged for not overlooking a few things the Republicans do...why this?
In all honesty, I’m so disconnected from the pulse of politics now that it’s so damn toxic, that I don’t even know if BLM is a libertarian thing. I hope not.
Beyond BLM support, which I doubt, that's a huge yes to all the others.
Unless you are actually defending that crap?
It's probably not, and it sticks out because I fully agree with the other stuff.
Here comes a random quotemine...
masterswimmer
.450/400 Nitro Ex
You're misquoting what President Trump said on his campaign trail. He didn't say we're importing dregs from other countries. He said with open borders we're also welcoming the dregs of society without resistance. If everyone follows the immigration laws those who are entering with nefarious intent can be vetted before entering as opposed to them already being here, breaking additional laws and only catching them when they do get caught.
spat
.950 JDJ
Well, sacrificing our culture is a problem.
I am all in favor of immigrants to want to come here *and become American*. We should be encouraging them and it should be easier than it is.
*However* people who want to come here and then transform our culture into the one they are escaping from should not be welcome. They left the old place for a reason, please do not recreate those problems here.
That goes as much for people leaving blue states for red as it does for immigrants leaving a socialist hell hole for the US.
Jcp123
.357 mag
Yeah, but what I’m talking about is the tone and timbre of that. No matter what was said, he came off in a bad way.
I’m probably coloured in a lot of ways. I grew up in a suburb where Asians were a 3:1 majority, split among mostly Chinese, then Indians, Filipinos, Vietnamese, and Japanese. Hispanics were at near parity with caucasians.
So, I’m comfortable with, and like other folks around me. In some soft way, I feel like I was enriched by it. And I am probably biased by not now being surrounded by other languages or folks who interact differently. It was a culture shock to not expect that when I moved to Texas.
My Ma is an immigrant, been here since 1973. My wife is Hispanic. There’s a lot to this which goes deep into my psyche and history. Trump may not realize it, but his comments cut deep to a lot of people, and that may or may not come back to bite him.
Perception is reality.
Refine the message.
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