NYSRPA v. Bruen, NY 2A Case Supreme Court case and decision

Z

Zerex

.308 Win
Messages
2,874
Reaction score
2,302
Location
Rome, NY
I have watched several police encounters recently in an urban area..

First, a man ran off with a laptop computer from a repair shop, while owner was working on another box. I was there.
Cops called..no response..fool thief was seen close by, shortly thereafter, with stolen computer, and shop owner and friend chased the thief down and assaulted him, confined him and dragged him and computer back by the ear. Not me, my knees are too bad to run.
Cops came..released guy because computer was now back....no appearance tickets, cops winked at shop owner and left....no one patted down.

Another incident involving a car accident close by.....one party to hospital, other driver questioned, and left by other vehicle..no pat downs.

3rd incident in same area....madman with no shirt, carrying a 2 x 4 began slamming it down on pavement in anger at someone close by; cops came took 2 x 4 let him go...no pat downs.

I am not saying that pat downs may never happen, but you have to be very suspicious, and really nuts, to generate that kind of behavior from cops.

"Appearance tickets" are the norm today ,and as few of them that can be written/generated, is also the norm.

This paranoia sounds like the old "Narcs" paranoia from the 1970's.

No cop is going to find you, for normal behavior, for slipping a gun into your pocket to go out for a bottle of milk after dark....why would he stop you?
Ships passing in the night.........do not display the gun in any way, like 1ames bond....

Bar room carry, is an invitation to ail for sure.

 
Cavalry

Cavalry

.308 Win
Messages
4,996
Reaction score
8,761
Location
Behind Enemy Lines
Zerex said:
Bar room carry, is an invitation to ail for sure.
Click to expand...
So what about the last 100+ years when it was perfectly legal to carry in a bar in NY? Where were the wild west shootouts?
I do not think its appropriate to be shit faced drunk at 2am while carrying but I also do not think a law should prohibit that action. There are already laws prohibiting shooting someone unjustified, menacing, etc that should be enough.
We are not talking about just bars here, we are talking about places that serve alcohol. Go out to dinner at shithole applebees or any thousands of other "bar and grill" type establishments and you would need to be disarmed.
 
spat

spat

.700 Nitro Express
Messages
29,526
Reaction score
62,150
Location
Formerly Geneseo, NY. Now free in AZ
Zerex said:
I have watched several police encounters recently in an urban area..

First, a man ran off with a laptop computer from a repair shop, while owner was working on another box. I was there.
Cops called..no response..fool thief was seen close by, shortly thereafter, with stolen computer, and shop owner and friend chased the thief down and assaulted him, confined him and dragged him and computer back by the ear. Not me, my knees are too bad to run.
Cops came..released guy because computer was now back....no appearance tickets, cops winked at shop owner and left....no one patted down.

Another incident involving a car accident close by.....one party to hospital, other driver questioned, and left by other vehicle..no pat downs.

3rd incident in same area....madman with no shirt, carrying a 2 x 4 began slamming it down on pavement in anger at someone close by; cops came took 2 x 4 let him go...no pat downs.

I am not saying that pat downs may never happen, but you have to be very suspicious, and really nuts, to generate that kind of behavior from cops.

"Appearance tickets" are the norm today ,and as few of them that can be written/generated, is also the norm.

This paranoia sounds like the old "Narcs" paranoia from the 1970's.

No cop is going to find you, for normal behavior, for slipping a gun into your pocket to go out for a bottle of milk after dark....why would he stop you?
Ships passing in the night.........do not display the gun in any way, like 1ames bond....

Bar room carry, is an invitation to ail for sure.
Click to expand...
Concealed is concealed is all well and good unless you actually *need* the gun.

If you can't actually use it to legally defend yourself, that becomes a major problem.

There is also a huge difference between "drunk and carrying" vs "carrying where they serve alcohol".

The 1st is utterly irresponsible. The second is utterly normal.
 
Rap

Rap

.357 mag
Messages
609
Reaction score
598
Location
Monroe
Zerex said:
I have watched several police encounters recently in an urban area..

First, a man ran off with a laptop computer from a repair shop, while owner was working on another box. I was there.
Cops called..no response..fool thief was seen close by, shortly thereafter, with stolen computer, and shop owner and friend chased the thief down and assaulted him, confined him and dragged him and computer back by the ear. Not me, my knees are too bad to run.
Cops came..released guy because computer was now back....no appearance tickets, cops winked at shop owner and left....no one patted down.

Another incident involving a car accident close by.....one party to hospital, other driver questioned, and left by other vehicle..no pat downs.

3rd incident in same area....madman with no shirt, carrying a 2 x 4 began slamming it down on pavement in anger at someone close by; cops came took 2 x 4 let him go...no pat downs.

I am not saying that pat downs may never happen, but you have to be very suspicious, and really nuts, to generate that kind of behavior from cops.

"Appearance tickets" are the norm today ,and as few of them that can be written/generated, is also the norm.

This paranoia sounds like the old "Narcs" paranoia from the 1970's.

No cop is going to find you, for normal behavior, for slipping a gun into your pocket to go out for a bottle of milk after dark....why would he stop you?
Ships passing in the night.........do not display the gun in any way, like 1ames bond....

Bar room carry, is an invitation to ail for sure.
Click to expand...
Carrying being on the books as a crime is the problem, full stop.

Some folks WILL receive criminal treatment/suspicion whether warranted or not. Don't know what city you are in, but calling folks paranoid for this wildly broad new felony being added to the books suggests to me that you may be out of touch with urban dynamics.
 
N

NYCGuy

9mm
Messages
94
Reaction score
118
Location
NYC
spat said:
The NY/CA overreaction might actually be a good thing in the long run.

If we can get this back to SCOTUS while we've still got the same 5 justices we could get a ruling that you can't restrict firearm ownership anywhere you don't actually have controlled access (i.e. metal detectors and guards) because otherwise you are arbitrarily restricting the rights of the law abiding people while doing nothing at all to prevent criminals from bringing in guns.
Click to expand...
Seems like there will be endless fuckery. Scotus decisions are too lengthy. There will always be one or two sentences that NY and lower courts will hold on to, to keep the same game going.
It seems I was right, insofar as Alito’s concurrence is the guiding hand for NY. As he said, nothing to see here, you can still have all the requirements you want NY. I don’t see a district court shutting down anything NY is doing, simply because they can point to Alito’s own words. They’ll hang on to that shit for dear life.
Somebody needs to fill out the application as follows:
1) Answer no to any felony or violent crime convictions
2) No references
3) Cross out anywhere that mentions “good moral character”
4) Answer No to illegal drug use
5) Answer “this is irrelevant” to every other question
6) Sue sue sue and hopefully the circuit courts will make the process more straightforward and fair
 
Steal2B

Steal2B

.700 Nitro Express
Messages
25,775
Reaction score
81,682
Location
Dutchess County
Egret-II said:
For the Westchester people.

View attachment 164754

Click to expand...
The new laws essentially relegate full concealed carry permits, even those with a demonstrated life threatening "proper cause", to a quite useless premise permit putting lives at risk and gutting second amendment rights with the State's vindictive unconstitutional rant. Legal action is overdue.
 
T

Truebeliever

6.5 Creedmoor
Messages
2,490
Reaction score
1,622
Location
Nys
Zerex said:
Stop and Frisk is as dead as a dodo...............no store owner can lay a hand on you and frisk you...cops either.

Unless you are determined to flash a belt carry holster, almost openly, and shout to the world........".FUCK YOU-- IN YOUR FACE", like Rambo, no one will ever know ,OR SHOULD KNOW, that you are carrying a gun concealed, legally..........women carry on purses all the time.

Be like James Bond..the law is now on your side.

On the first 48 the other night, in 2019, Tusla cops lead a skinny short, 120 lb women out in cuffs, then frisked her, and she was concealing a glock in her tight yoga pants , in her rear end area...could not be detected except by frisking.

CONCEALED CARRY IS NOT OPEN CARRY.
Click to expand...
You are incorrect. Police can still conduct terry stops and frisk people.
 
Saltwater60

Saltwater60

20×102mm Vulcan
Messages
35,260
Reaction score
39,652
Location
Western NY
spat said:
The NY/CA overreaction might actually be a good thing in the long run.

If we can get this back to SCOTUS while we've still got the same 5 justices we could get a ruling that you can't restrict firearm ownership anywhere you don't actually have controlled access (i.e. metal detectors and guards) because otherwise you are arbitrarily restricting the rights of the law abiding people while doing nothing at all to prevent criminals from bringing in guns.
Click to expand...
Also every public space and private business can’t be a special place or whatever they are calling it and restrict your rights there.
 
T

Truebeliever

6.5 Creedmoor
Messages
2,490
Reaction score
1,622
Location
Nys
Zerex said:
I have watched several police encounters recently in an urban area..

First, a man ran off with a laptop computer from a repair shop, while owner was working on another box. I was there.
Cops called..no response..fool thief was seen close by, shortly thereafter, with stolen computer, and shop owner and friend chased the thief down and assaulted him, confined him and dragged him and computer back by the ear. Not me, my knees are too bad to run.
Cops came..released guy because computer was now back....no appearance tickets, cops winked at shop owner and left....no one patted down.

Another incident involving a car accident close by.....one party to hospital, other driver questioned, and left by other vehicle..no pat downs.

3rd incident in same area....madman with no shirt, carrying a 2 x 4 began slamming it down on pavement in anger at someone close by; cops came took 2 x 4 let him go...no pat downs.

I am not saying that pat downs may never happen, but you have to be very suspicious, and really nuts, to generate that kind of behavior from cops.

"Appearance tickets" are the norm today ,and as few of them that can be written/generated, is also the norm.

This paranoia sounds like the old "Narcs" paranoia from the 1970's.

No cop is going to find you, for normal behavior, for slipping a gun into your pocket to go out for a bottle of milk after dark....why would he stop you?
Ships passing in the night.........do not display the gun in any way, like 1ames bond....

Bar room carry, is an invitation to ail for sure.
Click to expand...
Do you know why they didn’t do a pat down? The answer is …. Because they didn’t want to find something. They got rid of someone who would be an easy arrest.
 
gun_slinger_boy

gun_slinger_boy

.338 Win Mag
Messages
5,475
Reaction score
7,237
Location
Pennsyltucky
L

lrick

6.5 Creedmoor
Messages
2,435
Reaction score
5,534
Location
NY
Glock_USA said:
Doesn't work that way. The complaint is you were suspicious. The pat down is completely constitutional. Its been upheld over and over. Any encounter. Pat pat pat. No weapon, no problem. Again, its not a search.
Click to expand...
Great. Then what they will find is the biggest, bulkiest OWB holster I can find printing like a billboard, holstering a big ole Chiquita banana. Hey, I'm hypoglycemic and there's no law against carrying a concealed banana, is there?
Overwhelm them with enough wild goose chases, and they'll either drop it or create a law that requires us to open-carry our bananas.
 
L

lrick

6.5 Creedmoor
Messages
2,435
Reaction score
5,534
Location
NY
Truebeliever said:
A fundamental thing wrong with NY sign law is that the owner can verbally give you permission but you would still be in violation of that law if he doesn’t have a sign
Click to expand...
Initially the law grants the owner the right to determine policy or temporarily suspend that policy but the state trumps it anyway because of the sign or lack thereof? Seems to me this is really a trespass issue, in which the state has determined what conditions constitutes a "trespass". The state is not just violating 2A rights, it is violating private property rights.

A somewhat similar analogy would be not being able to track a wounded deer onto posted property even with the owners permission. By that logic, as long as the signs are up, you are trespassing regardless of the owner's permission until the owner takes them down.

Fundamentally wrong is an understatement.
 
N

NYCGuy

9mm
Messages
94
Reaction score
118
Location
NYC
lrick said:
Great. Then what they will find is the biggest, bulkiest OWB holster I can find printing like a billboard, holstering a big ole Chiquita banana. Hey, I'm hypoglycemic and there's no law against carrying a concealed banana, is there?
Overwhelm them with enough wild goose chases, and they'll either drop it or create a law that requires us to open-carry our bananas.
Click to expand...
This is awesome lol
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top